How IoT is Reshaping the Sustainability Debate

Hello everybody and welcome to today’s Soracom webinar session. Really great to welcome you all here for the session on how IoT is reshaping the sustainability debate. Thank you so much for taking time out of your diary, and I know everyone’s very, busy at this time of year. So excited to have you all here and excited to get started. There are quite a few of us on the call today, and we have quite a lot to get through. So let’s make a start. Listen, here’s what we’re going to be covering over the next forty five minutes or so. So yes, a very quick introduction from me, and then I will hand over to our guest speaker, Saverio here, for majority of the presentation. Like I said at the beginning, today we’re going to be looking at the role of IoT within the sustainability debate. We’ll leave plenty of time towards the end for any questions. And actually, would really encourage you to use the chat window that you can see here for any questions on any of the topics that are raised throughout the presentation. So yeah, just a quick introduction. My name is Duncan. I’m head of marketing here at Soracom. And today, really pleased to welcome Saverio Romeo, who is an IoT lecturer and researcher at Birkbeck University in London, who is going to be doing majority of the of the presenting today. Hi there, Saverio. How are you? Hi, Duncan. I’m well. Thank you. Thank you for and I’m sorry everyone for for my mistake. It was my mistake. Sorry. That’s all good. Thank you so much for being here, Severio. We’re really really looking forward to your presentation shortly. Thank you for inviting me. Just before I hand the floor over to you, I’d like to spend no more than ninety seconds, guys. I just want to give a very brief introduction to who we are at Soracom, just to provide some context around why we’re hosting this session today. And just to say everyone’s aware of who we are and what we do. Now Soracom is a IoT connectivity and platform service for deployments and applications to help you launch at scale, basically. We provide affordable, reliable connectivity that can help you accelerate the speed to market. We make it easy to connect to the cloud. We can help you reduce data consumption and costs. And actually, there’s a very broad range of innovative solutions that I won’t go into detail now that we can help provide. Founded in Japan in 2015 by former AWS and telco veterans, and today we have physical offices in Tokyo, Seattle, and London. And actually, are a global team distributed all over the world. We’re really proud to serve more than twenty thousand startups, SMBs, and global enterprises. And we work with people from industries such as agriculture, energy, construction, consumer electronics, manufacturing, real estate, healthcare. The list goes on. Really, there isn’t any industry that has IoT requirements that we’re not able to support. And actually, you’ll find a Soracom SIM powering over four million devices around the world and providing connectivity via our IoT network. Financially supported by KDDI in Japan, and we also received investment from various technology partners, such as Hitachi, Secom, and Sony. I won’t go into any more detail right now, but if you would like to learn more about the services we provide and how we may be able to help you with your IoT project, you can just visit us at Soracom.Io, where you can learn more about the platform. You can arrange a consultation with one of our product specialists, or you can even create your own account and start experimenting with the platform today. Okay. That’s enough about Soracom and enough for me for now. Let’s hand it over to Saverio for the main event. Just a final reminder, if you can just use that questions, that chat panel on the right hand side of your screen for any questions, and we’ll get to those towards the end. And without any further ado, I’ll hand over to Saverio. So Saverio, over to Thank Duncan, and welcome everyone. Hope you are having a good day. Thank you, Duncan and Soracom for having me to talk about this specific topic I’m running researching on. If you can go to the next slide, Duncan, please. Just a few words about me, what I’m doing at the moment. I have an associate lecturer at Birkbeck in which there is a centre for innovation management research. And in this centre, I’m the one with another two and I’m the only one who is not academic who looks at the adoption of emerging digital technologies. I bring into the story, let’s say my experience more in the industry and in the deployment of IoT solutions. You see a couple of projects I’m doing, I’m obviously I’m also a lead expert in the city of Derby, London Derby, Northern Ireland for a specific EU project in which we are looking at various angles for smart cities including sustainability and skills. More specifically linked to this presentation is my work I’m doing on IoT and other technologies can be used for territorial management. I’m referring in particular to wildfire prevention, water shortages and other topics in this sense. I’m also part of an expert group for European Union on new labor policy for the future of work as an expert on advanced technologies. If you go to next slide, I’ll try to gain the minutes I lost with my mistakes. So what I want to discuss today, I’m bringing together a bit of my experience in field and a bit of research we are doing in university and try to understand the role of the high OT in the debate in sustainability. One of the arguments I want to put forward is that the IoT or M2M world somehow was always a bit sustainable. Or another way, they had in mind even indirectly the role of environment and the potential role of M2M and IoT in environmental issues. Then I want to emphasize that the new socio political economic scenarios are guiding attention towards sustainability in a completely different way, creating momentum for technologies to become an important enabler for green policy, sustainable policy. Then I’ll give you some examples on how the IoT and these are primarily examples on which I’m working on on how the IoT is contributing to the sustainability and sustainable debate. Also, highlight some problems that the IoT can have from a sustainability point of view. And towards the end, a bit of a discussion on the convergence of IoT with other technologies and also their potential impact. And then I have two questions at the end which I would like to hear your voice and your opinion about if it is possible to talk about sustainable by design IoT and what the actual IoT world should do, the IoT community should do in order to embrace and become more protagonist in the sustainability debate. So, if you go to next slide please. The definition of sustainability starts from the UN SDG. Obviously, the UN SDGs are not all directly related to the environment. In fact, if you go to next slide please, Duncan. I know these slides you cannot read very well, but when you will receive the PowerPoint presentations and you will see in these slides the link below, this is basically a progress report from the UN on all the initiatives that are environmental related. The report basically says that the environmental angle in the SDGs is more or less in all the SDGs and under the SDGs there are lot of activities to do and a lot of activities in which technologies can have an important role. Please go to the next slide. Now, as I said, in my opinion M2M had a sort of unknown environmental nature and this is George Paraskevakos, as kind of widely recognized as sort of father of M2M. In nineteen seventy seven, he designed these technologies to move data from one machine to the other and he was also a very prolific entrepreneur and he founded one of the first companies founded, it was called Metrotech and was basically doing remote metering reading. So, the one that then evolved into what we know today as smart meters. And smart meters, they have an environmental angle, which is the one that optimizes, measures the consumption of energy in order to optimize that consumptions and reducing the misuse or the excessive use of energy. I think the M2M world evolved a lot around these ideas. Yes, there was a strong focus on telematics, but if you go back a bit on the history of M2M IoT and you go and see case studies around the 2000s or even before, there were already cases of environmental monitoring through M2M technology. So there was an environmental nature into the M2M. There was not a business reason for doing it probably. Because the actual revenue reason was elsewhere rather than on this type of application. Also there was not the momentum for driving maybe more attention specific topic, also to think about a bit more about the business models maybe on how to translate environmental applications into something that would also be revenue generating. In fact, if we go to next slide, this report is one of the many very nice Ofcom reports on M2M and then IoT. I’m sure in the audience, this is an expert audience, imagine they know who OFCOM is, know, OFCOM is one of the most cutting edge regulators worldwide. I remember being in meetings of the regulator group authority in the European Union in process on how the word of Ofcom was recognized as the most relevant one, maybe in a certain sense. And there is this report in 2014, it is about spectrum because for a regulator the spectrum is a key topic, but it’s about M2M applications and what are the necessity of spectrum for M2M applications. You go and see the report or at least you just see the table of contents and you see how often recognizes certain type of applications that today we put under the umbrella of sustainability. So, intelligent buildings, smart cities, utilities, the metering of water, the metering of energy and so on. But in this report, the word adjective sustainable green or the word sustainability does not appear at all. There is zero, there is not you go to do the search, there is nothing like that. The sign is that, in 2014 we were kind of moving from the M2M momentum towards the idea that DieHamtung was moving towards the high UT. Despite the term ‘Internet of Things’ was established in 2009, we started really to get the momentum there. It was felt by the industry, there was a lot of activity in the automotive. So, it was a good phase for the M2M IoT world. And there was, at the same time a lot of consideration to the type of applications that today we will consider sort of green applications. But there was not the awareness of it. There was not the momentum for it. Basically, primarily for business reasons. There was no business around it. You have heard many times at those days on conferences: Yeah, you work with the public authorities, but the public authorities are slow. The procurement process is endless. So, don’t want to really deal with it. So, if we go to next slide, I think today the story evolved a bit more. And I think there are a couple of technologies in the world of IoT that maybe had a bit more of green nature, of sustainable nature. And I think one of these was LPWAN. And not just because as the acronym says, is looking for applications that consume less energy at device level and enable device to stay in the field for a long time. But what I’ve experienced a lot in the recent years is that LPWAN has really given motivation to local authorities, for example, to look at the IoT in a completely different way. Why am pressing on local authorities? Because local authorities are the ones that are really deploying, more than others, sustainable applications in cities, in rural areas, in relation to agricultural policies and so on. LP ONE has created a sort of opened the door to the IoT for organization which did not really have the skills, the know how and even the will to engage with those technologies. So, we go to next slide, we go to today and I think the really turning point, it is the political environment. The political environments that we have in several countries and in several intergovernmental organisations has changed this approach. I’ll take as an example, because I know it quite well and I’m working around it, is the recovery plan for Europe that was designed basically to respond to the Covid challenge. And this recovery plan, the amount of money is in the slides, has two fundamental blocks. One block is the sustainable side, the green policies and the green tech and the other side is the digital. With the understanding and the strong stress that digital technologies are an enabler for green solutions. And therefore, if you go to the next slide, I think we have changed. This is a momentum for the IoT. Because IoT, what it does, the IoT basically, as we all know here, it sends the space. We have an environment and through the sensor deployed, we gather the data and this data give us the picture of this space. And this data and the analysis of it will enable us to take decisions. So the IoT does not directly impact sustainable solutions but enable the development of sustainable solutions. I’ll give you some examples starting from the next slide. The next slide, Yes. This is taken from OneM2M. Again, I think you all know what OneM2M is. OneM2M has done a study on IoT sustainability. The link is on the bottom of the page and testing something pages. It’s a good reading, it’s a good way to look at it. And they used a bit the SDG angle, they used some SDG and then they say what are the significant role of the IoT technologies? As I said before, it’s the sensing of the space, the data, maybe the cross data, also the fact that I can have different type of data about a specific space and they can influence this IoT, the development of solutions that aim at the objective of the UNSDG in order to basically reduce energy consumption, optimizing resources about water for example and many others. So, I’ll give you now from next slide, Duncan, if you could Yeah, I’ll give you some examples. Some of them I lived in a sense that I was in the field with the organizations working on it. Some other are more based on research rather than in field experience. So this is an in field experience, it’s a water resource management. This is a little town in south of Italy with a strong agri food sector. Six thousand inhabitants during summer time, there is a bit more. But there is a lot of high quality agri food activities. The problem is that recently, as you probably have experienced or see personally, the temperature has raised. So, example, two summers ago we were around thirty eight, thirty nine, some peaks. And that has also caused lack of water. Lack of water so for days, actually for a week in one circumstances. And that is affected, but from the community, also the agri tech sector. Now, the main reason why the water was not there, firstly was the high temperature and therefore the lack of the resource, but was also an obsolete water network system. And the situation was that there were a lot of leaks and even the technicians in the agency who managed the water system were struggling to identify where the leak was. Identifying the leak was me looking the water coming out from a pipe and called them up, Me citizens. So the idea was okay, let’s use these potential EU based projects to modernize the water network system and bear in mind, this is a problem for this town, it’s a problem for many other towns, for entire regions in the area. So, the idea is okay, let’s also do a project that enables basically the substitution, if you want, the transformation, probably is better, of the water network system. And let’s also do it in a way that we can introduce technology that enable us to optimize this resource, primarily to manage the leaks, for example, to avoid the leaks at all. And also to have a picture of these water pipes. The picture with water pipes was in the head of a technician who was sixty one years old, who was the only one who actually remember, more or less in his head, where the pipes were. You can imagine the problems there. So, we started this test and the test of a replacement of the pipes in certain parts which were close to some agri food companies and with a system of sensors, two water sensors. They gathered the data about the flow of the water into the pipes and it was also nice to have the dashboards and the more young employees in water agency were really appreciating the fact that now I can see this picture in front of me, how the network is. Now, there is one consideration here. It is still a bit difficult to estimate the effect of these solutions. But if you go and see around in the literature of a host in the marketplace, this is a type of solution that’s being deployed for optimizing resources like water and therefore meet the SDGs number six as you see in the picture. If you go to next slide, I need to run a bit more. Yes, this is on the high quality noise sensors. This is on the project coming with Derby London Derby. And again, there is a link on the bottom. You see it’s a marketplace of one hundred and fifteen European cities and you can see all the projects each city is doing. This is a Spanish city and the project is about creating smart post, we can call it, in which we have basically air quality sensors and noise sensors. And this helps to planning traffic around schools and so on. And this is, let’s say, in the area of smart cities. If we go to next slide, the smart farming one. The smart farming is a big one. It’s a vast area. It is also an unbelievably innovative area. Let’s free ourselves from the conception that agriculture is a traditional sector, it is not. And actually, IoT is a fundamental enabler of this innovation into agriculture. On the slides, you see all the areas in which the presence of IoT can transform the farming process and transforming it in terms of quality, in terms of optimising again the resources in how you perform all the farming tasks. Should be said that farming itself is quite substantial contributor to CO2 emissions in particularly the livestock farming as we all know and all the dairy transformation side of it. Questions remain if Precision Livestock Farming in which IoT has an important role can help reduce these CO2 emissions from livestock farming or contribute to it is an opening question. If we go to the next slide, on the smart city debate, I think we have all experienced the debate of smart city with the narrative in which we applied digital technology to city to transform the city in innovation terms and therefore in an economic growth terms. So there was a more, let’s say, market company centric approach to smart city and also very maybe silo. In a sense, I’m going to do the smart parking project and that is the smart city for me. I’m doing the specific public sector camera network and that is a specific project for me. The move is on one side to see the city more holistically and therefore the smart city has a smart system of smart systems because you need to take care of the transport, the water, the waste and all that. And on the other side, there is an important hindrance of the sustainable variable. So the objective becomes quality of life of citizens and understanding the environmental situation in the city. You go and see and I participate to a couple of them, some smart city strategy development have changed dramatically because you have around the table all the stakeholders in the cities and the things that you discuss are not really technical at all almost, but you look at what you want to, which are the objectives of the smart city strategy and sustainability is a key one, is becoming a key one. In the link in the slides of the health sensor you can find a lot of sources if you want on the smart city and sustainable strategy. If you go to next slide. An example of city who has the core policy is the sustainability side is Espoo in Finland. Now Espoo is an unbelievable example as a smart city, in a sense that has embraced, if you want, all a bit the theory that there is a smart city from a technological perspective and they have an open data model of the local authority, which is quite something. And now the next step for them is really towards combining the smartness with sustainability. And these are in this picture, these are the four objectives of the city to go towards 2030. It’s an extremely incredible example. Generally, I have to say, the Finnish environment very rich in nice use case studies around smart city sustainability. Okay, if we go to next slide. Yes, this is all great and we can find a lot of other examples together and I’m sure you have yours. But, it’s important to consider that the IoT per se has a green influence then and that is about the energy consumption. This is a quote from a report from International Energy Agency in which analyze the devices connected in standby and estimate in 2015 a consumption of six hundred terawatts per hour, then the same reports does the estimation towards 2020 in which they assumed at the time we could have fifty billion euros for a double the consumption. So the energy consumption is an issue. But in defense, if you go to next slide, let’s take the defense of the IoT. The energy consumption has been always something in the mind of the IoT solution designer and developer. I think the LPWAN story gives a good hope there. There was a consideration effect on this. Apart from that, there is a lot of research standardization process to look at and that is happening today and that looks at, so they call it green IoT. Probably have seen it on the picture here, have some of the most well known standardization and research body. The ITUT, the study group twenty looks specifically at the sustainability of IoT in city environments. Then you have high triple E, high ETF and so on. Let’s also not forget the issue of waste or e waste. What do we do with all these devices when we need to get rid of it? Probably in that sense, in terms of legislation, are a bit more ahead probably. We need to find ways of better recycling our devices, if it’s possible to recycle or to see what to do with it. But the ‘W’, the waste from electronic electrical and electronic equipment directive is an interesting one. If you go to the next slide. So, the IoT does the gathering of the data, sends the space and then use this data in analytics term. This is a paper from Michael Posters and the CEO of PTC 2014 paper in which they looked at the evolution of the IoT. Obviously, you start to have the data from the IoT, you start to do the analysis of the data, you know, you get seeing the data creates more appetite for more data, analysis, for more insights. But this appetite can be satisfied if you create the convergence between the the IoT and other emerging technologies. And one of that is the artificial intelligence that brings up to some of the discussions and application we are seeing in terms of predictive maintenance, for example, automation of actions and so on. So, if we go next this way, just an example into the next slide, Duncan, is on wildfire detection. Again, I’m sure you’ve followed the news in the last couple of summers. A substantial problem for some parts of the world and there are a number of I mean, I counted in my work so far, five companies worldwide with an incredible presence in Australia. There are quite incredible ecosystems in this area, for obvious reasons. They have some quite substantial wildfires recently. The work they do, these organizations, based on convergence of technology. So, can imagine a sort of, if we want to use a bit of engineering stock that we like a lot, we have the IoT as the data collection layer and then we have on the top the use of applications that enable the elaboration of that data in a very sophisticated way. So, have the artificial intelligence company working in digital twins, with digital twins to have the heat map of the area, for example. Interesting to notice in this app also from a connectivity point of view, considering our host, there is an incredible combination of connectivity forms for this type of application. So, you have the IoT sensor network based on LPWAN but there is a lot of satellite observation that needs to be done. There are solutions that they put cameras into the forest and they create network cameras. Some other solution puts in sort of objects on the trees to observe the situation around the specific tree. And so there is a lot of innovative thinking that is enabled by the convergence of these technologies. The problem anyway, if you go to the next slide, yes, there is a huge potential in this convergence. There is also a problem on the energy consumption, particularly from the artificial intelligence side. And I invite you to read this paper, it’s very short Carbon Tracker. It’s five pages from a professor, I don’t remember his name, from Denmark, in which basically he is creating an assessment on how to measure the consumption of AI models in terms of energy. And if you see from the article, the AI meet to the moon, So basically, he is estimating in his assessment for carbon tracker that is equivalent, certain type of analysis are equivalent to go from Earth to the Moon and come back. So, energy consumption issues into the AI and generally into these technologies is becoming important to consider. So, if we go to next slide, almost there, think. My key conclusions are that the M2M IoT had always in mind or maybe in the back of the mind, but was always a bit there, the idea of technology for the environment. It was not the right momentum at the time. I think that today, with the new, the changes in the social debate about climate change, but also on political debate with substantial investments as you’ve seen from the EU. But the same you can come and see from the UK government, the US is quite common approach. I think there is an opportunity for the IoT to really stress its enabling nature of sustainable solutions and not just because you want to be nice to do sustainability, which is also good for a variety of reasons, but also because maybe there is also a new revenue stream there to explore. And this enabling capability is across the UN Sustainable Goals. So it goes a bit all over and the IoT we know is kind of the building block of digital transformation in any sectors we can imagine. And then going further, the convergence between IoT with other technologies also has a potential to contribute. As a community, I think you need to, it’s important to consider that you also have a green issue, if you want, and something to face, some problems, some challenges to face. So if you go to the next slide, these are the two questions that I’m exploring more. I’d like to know maybe your opinion is, what is necessary to change maybe in companies, in IoT vendors, in IoT solution providers in order to address these? For example, need to be a bit more friendly maybe with public authorities. Sorry if I say that, just joking a bit. As we talk, we need to do security by design and IoT solution development. Shall we or can we or maybe it’s not necessary talking about a sustainable by design IoT solution development framework? So these are two questions that I would like to know your view. And I think this is last slide from my side. I think we have some time for some questions. Thank you for listening to Amazing. Thank you, Saverio. That was a lot of information packed into a very short space of time. Really grateful for you throwing those slides together and talking us through your thoughts around it. Thank you very much. Wanted to save some time at the end of this for any questions from the people who have joined. We still have quite a few people on the call, which is great to see. Thank you for all of you all for being here. If you do have a question for Saverio around any of the topics presented today or anything around sustainability and IoT in general, please put them into that chat window. Actually, Nishi has left us a question here, Sverio, around. Are there any case studies where IoT use for electricity and natural gas are particularly relevant? Have you got any thoughts on that one? On gas, on gas obviously we can think about, I’m not entirely sure, but maybe I can do a bit of research on my side and answer it a bit later. But on the pipeline monitoring, as the example of water, when we want to avoid leakages and misuse. On oil and gas, I see a lot of application around pipeline monitoring, which again was a traditional M2M application, but it’s becoming more and more sophisticated in IoT. So, yes. Then, when you talk about IoT for electricity, if we want to talk about all the world of smart grid or smart energy and it becomes very big, mean the IoT is definitely a fundamental block there and just for smart metering, but also for on the transmission side, on the distribution side. Do we want to do, for example, remote monitoring of offshore wind farms? Yes, there are a lot of cases to look at. So, the answer is yes. It’s probably not a very complete answer, but on the natural gas specifically, I can investigate a bit more. And if you want something to look at, I can suggest it. Give me an afternoon. That’s great. Thank you, Saverio. I I actually had a question as well. If if anyone else has any questions, please please do enter them into the chat window in in in the screen. But you you presented a slide earlier on Saverio that was around smart farming. And you touched quite quite briefly on it, but I wondered if I could ask you a bit more more deeply about it. I wondered if when you were talking about precision farming, are there any examples that you can think of or any particularly good use cases of where IoT can help reduce CO2 emissions, particular within precision farming? Because, you know, obviously an area where there’s a huge carbon footprint. So just curious to know if there’s any examples that Yeah. So on livestock, which is the, as we know, one of the top sector, one of the top contributors to CO2 emission unfortunately. There is a lot of research work and trial on how precision livestock can help in that sense. But I’ve not seen commercial deployments. I mean, can look into it a bit more, but that is a very hot topic for farming in terms of CO2 emission. There is a lot of case studies about optimizing resources in farming, optimizing water, reducing fertilizing and there are a lot on the precision agriculture, for example, that use the drivers combined investors in big farm obviously. You look at John Deere, the center in Germany has a lot of case studies there. Company like GEA Technologies, always in Germany, yes, also a nice example. On specifically reducing the CO2, I think in the sense we talked before, there is a bit less, I think. There is a very nice collection of project, flagship program called the Demeter’, the Greek goddess of agriculture. Right. You go I found the link, I’ll send you the link, you can share with the audience. Then there are also a number of projects in which IoT is everywhere and in which maybe we can find specific ones on CO2 emissions. Primarily what I see, what I experienced was more optimizing resources in farming activities. Yeah. That’s great. Thank you for providing that answer. There are just a couple of questions here from Kataro. And apologies if I’m pronouncing that wrong. But the first question here is how can we keep the balance of energy reduction from IoT devices and the consumption that’s necessary for them to use in use cases such as transportation, installation and the maintenance of devices? Perhaps I’m not sure if you can see that question written in the chat there, Severio. You have any kind of thoughts around that topic? I think it’s a very open question. I don’t have a proper answer to that. It’s a research question that you go and see on the one M2M white paper is more or less stated the same. And there are a lot of activity in how to reduce the energy consumption of an IoT solution at the various steps. So how do you reduce the energy of a device? How do you reduce the energy of the connectivity? How do you reduce the energy when you elaborate the data into the cloud? But I do not have an idea on how on how we can balance that. But maybe Quite an open one. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. The the the other one, the and and the final one I think we have here is how how can we gather certain amounts of data for for these business requirements? So you talked about the fire use case earlier on. Fire and a mountain will rarely happen, but if we can detect that with an algorithm, would it need at least ten thousand or more data for training purposes? Yes. The way of gathering this data at the moment, as I said, is primarily to basically populate forest of sensors and to enable therefore and to make these sensor networks very dense of sensors in order to gather as much data as you can. I think that in theory can be done. What I see is more the actual feasibility of it. How you actually deploy on vast forests which can be under threat and you know the speed, one of the variable you’re going to measure is the speed of the fire. And the speed of the fire is what it is. And how do you deploy in vast forests all these amount of sensors? In fact, a lot of the applications that are showed by these forty-forty five companies I’ve looked at are primarily proof of concept. And then there is the other option in which company says, okay, look, it’s crazy to put ten thousand sensors, twenty thousand sensors in all these. Let’s move up and so let’s use the drone. So you see applications in which you launch drones to cover certain area substituting, the covering of the drones instead of deploying, I don’t know, ten sensor within a specific part of the forest. All in progress. There’s a lot of work on that. I get the point. That’s great. Thank you for that. We only have a few minutes left and we’ve got a couple of good questions here that I’d like to get to if we have time. So this is really great one from Sarah, who asks about the environmental impact of IoT devices. And she says, Do you have any examples of where we can design or reuse or repurpose these products so that they are more environmentally friendly? Wow, these are great questions. Great question, yeah, thank you, sir. I have a case study in mind in which a device was reused. I think it was a water device. Let me look into it and I’ll send you the link. I’ve not seen many. In fact, there is a working group, I think it is in IEEE that looks specifically on this part. So not something that has been a huge adoption of, but potentially quite a good idea then? I think it is a great idea. I guess it is how do we do it. Right. Yeah. Fantastic. Thank you for that, Sarah. I wanna get to Peter’s question since he’s a big believer in using IoT data to make smarter decisions, which I think we can all agree with. It’s a great point. Have you got any examples of where this has been the case for leading to more sustainable methods and integrated processes? Any thoughts on that one at all, Saverio? I think in smart cities, we start to see a change of mentality in the local authority and in the people working with technology. So, the mentality maybe is not the nice way of saying. A bit of culture change on understanding the importance of data has an enabler, probably the only enabler really for proper decisions on city planning, on lighting, on parking. You see cities like Barcelona or London that embraced the concept of smart city fifteen years ago, we are in a completely different level. I have experienced incredible experiences of which I’m going to a local authority and I’m asking them, have you done IoT based solution before? They say, yeah, we have a smart lighting solution. Oh, great. So, in my mind we can maybe reshape the post of the light where you have the sensor and put other sensor in it and so on. And then I asked, okay, what do you do with this smart lighting? What actually you do? And I said, what the data is? Can you show me, I don’t know, a dashboard, I don’t know, even Excel file, I don’t know, whatever. And the response was that the data I’ve never seen the data, Sarelia. The data is with the provider of the solutions. And this is one of the extreme cases. But this was four years ago. This is changing. You see now in this project in which I have, you see a lot of attention in Smart City on using the data, as you said, Peter, for smarter decisions, for planning the transport, bus systems for example, and traffic a lot in that direction, yes. I think if you go to that slide, to that link, in that link is a market place, you will find some interesting cases. We’ll be sending the slide deck around to everyone who signed up afterwards. So yeah, anyone will be able to explore those links in a little bit more detail. We have one minute left and I just wanna get to Andreas’ question very quickly. So Andreas asks regarding the business requirements for IoT systems, is there any research or collections of common requirements that you see always turn up, Severio? No. So I think because the IoT is very context aware, everything changes context by context, application by applications. I don’t see very similar common requirements. One common requirement that is increasingly getting to it also in the procurement process, for example. Sorry if I go back to SMARSEED, but it’s stuff that is very close to me in time at the moment. If you go and see on the procurement process in cities, one common requirement is what Peter said before. Right. Yeah, so you do these solutions. You do a smart lighting solution, then let’s discuss what we do with the data. So the potential analysis of the data and how we use it. Another common requirement maybe is I won’t post a post solution sub post, which is in my opinion is very good because sometimes you do IoT solution to someone and you implement, you do it and then you go and then the customer had the first problem and doesn’t know what to do. Today, a lot of IoT companies, a lot of them, they’re kind of not pushing but I think they’re arguing towards the customer, in this case with the cities, it’s important to have me. That you know you can call me if something goes wrong. And I think this post sales support, let’s call it like that, is useful. That’s great. Fantastic. Wow, these are amazing questions. Thank you so much everybody for asking them. I’m I’m glad you’re the one giving the answers and and not me, Severio. So great great job answering all of those. Listen. We we we are at time, so I I think it’s it’s now a good time to wrap up. It’s just about all we have time for. All all that really makes me say is is is just a huge thanks to you, Severio, for preparing today’s presentation and answering all the all the q and a. Thank you so much. You did a great job there. Thank you. Sorry for the beginning. Yeah. No. No problem. I’m all all all sorted now. And I I’d also like to say a huge thanks to everybody who’s who’s joined us live today as well for giving up time in your day. Like I said at the beginning, it’s an exceptionally busy time for everybody. So we really hope that you’ve found this session useful. And hopefully, we’ll see you again at a future webinar in the not too distant future. Remember, if you’d like to learn more about SIRACOM, how we can help your IoT application connect to a secure network, access innovative tools that help you speed the time to market, reduce data consumption, transmit data to the cloud, and many more things, please visit suracom. Io where you can learn more about our platform and set up a call with one of our experts. That is just about it. We are right on time. In fact, we’re one minute over. Sorry for that. But thanks again, everyone, for joining, and we will see you again in the future. Thanks very much everyone. Goodbye. Have a good time. Bye bye. Bye.